Am I really a cheater?!?

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Hi Matt,
I really appreciate your blog!The Dropzilla list seems to work like a charm!Could you give me a detailed list (with all the biomorphs, etc...)?I sure would like to surprise some folks here in Cleveland with some drop podding beasties!
Steve
Congrats on the upcoming little one!Teach him or her to roll well1
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It was hard to respond to Steve because when I looked at my list I discovered that I made some REALLY gross misjudgements in errors when writing my list. I included a trygon prime with regen for 170 pts, and that doesnt even count the spore mine fiasco. I got confused when changing my list under the gun and made some mistakes. THe point of this post is not to maintain my honest integrity but to question the label of cheater. It is probably the worst label that can be given in our little niche hobby corner of the world. Am I a cheater? I cheated, with or without conscience effort! When do I go from making a mistake to cheating! Is it willfull misrepresentation or when I get something wrong?

17 comments:

Da Masta Cheef said...

Assuming it was done without conscious effort, then I'd say you just screwed up and/or suck @ math, but that's NOT cheating. Whereas WITH a conscious effort, then yes that would be cheating. Happens to everybody @ some point, I wouldn't worry too much about it. Sometimes we'll realize it mid-game & either add/remove something from game or skip it depending on what my opponent (or vice versa) thinks is cool.

I've run into this after slicing & dicing various lists to make a new one in MS Word. I usually have to go back through the dex & double check the numbers.

Basically though, the simple answer to your question is: No.

Steven Beasley said...

It depends. A local guy added a vindicator that wasn't in his list, because it used to be in the list, but had changed it. That is a big mistake. Sure we kidded him a bit about it, but I wouldn't label him a cheater. Now if he tried to sneak in and do it again, then sure I would. If it happened at a tournament, I might be a bit more perturbed. Now that you know, correct the list, and be done with it. No sense in beating your self up about it.

-Steve
Not the one from Cleveland, but oddly enough I live and work very near Cleveland. Small world for the Steve's in this world.

Sheriff said...

using hand written lists and playing against people you don't know well, who later finding out you played them with an illegal list. Will surely get you a bad reputation, and in our meta would get you black balled after a couple times. Do yourself a huge favor. get yourself Army builder, and print your list out in advance.When playing pickup games, treat every game with courtesy you do in a tournament and you will get a good reputation.
Chicken Scratch lists are for your good friends only when they know its an honest mistake.

HuronBH said...

No Matt, I would say you are not a cheater, but it does make you bad at Math when under pressure. Doing it blatantly and then denying that you did it would make you a cheater.

Fritz said...

Hey, its not liek you were caight with loaded dice or dropping those casino dice, or switching lists mid tournament....

Black Matt said...

Just so I am perfectly clear, I KNOW that I am not a cheater and I am not beating myself up over it. In my opinion, it all comes down to willfull misrepresentation of the truth. Anything else is just a mistake, regardless of the situation. If you are a big enough of an ASSHOLE for labeling someone a cheat with no more than your own annoyance and a public opportunity to shame someone, then you need to really look at yourself.

Derina said...

I used to work for GW in the Sailisbury store in the UK and was forced to play a game of wfb, he had an illigal army. never got payed extra.

He was Skaven I was Wood Elves.

And I know where you are coming from.

Black Matt said...

GUys,
my comment came off hard and rude. Excuse me, that was not my intent

NemFX said...

Accidents are accidents. Cheating is cheating. You had an accident.

fightclub said...

hey im the one he played and im not mad.it was a accident.but i want a rematch,lol

Harun said...

LOL. I feel for ya.

About a year ago I made a 2,500pts list for a 2,000pts game!

Luckily, I caught the mistake before we started playing.

But the reason I made the mistake in the first place was because it was my birthday the day before and I wasn't exactly at my best if you know what I mean. ;)

But to this day, my friends still tease me about it and jokingly want to double check all my lists.

Steven Beasley said...

Army builder (tm) for the win. Really it is a great product. You will spend all day just tweaking your lists. Trust me. www.wolflair.com

Fritz said...

All kidding aside, if done with the knowledge of it then it was cheating, as an accident after the fact, then not cheating, just an accident and being human. Of course knowing Matt, he will continue to torture himself over this for the next few weeks.

Black Matt said...

fightclub,
another spanking? OK but leave YO mamma at home this time. Friday evening? best i can do

Black Matt said...

Fritz,
I am going to torture you!

chaosgerbil said...

There's a new Sheriff in town... but he doesn't realize that Army Builder doesn't have the Tyranid files out yet.

Wow!

Steven Beasley said...

@chaosgerbil
You are right. I had forgot that they aren't out yet. No need to be snarky about it. Have a great day!